Georgiou Tsoukalos of Ancient Aliens talks with Joe Rogan about Prometheus

leading from

Prometheus Afterthoughts

transcribed from
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xku7Oj96r5k(Published on 27 Jun 2012)

Part 1 of Prometheus chat

Tsoukalos: I just think, I think it's funny that just like you know, one of the first alien movies or science fiction movies that in my opinion proposed the real idea, in Prometheus, if you go out there, you have to bring at least bring one archeologist. Prometheus is the first movie who has done that. In every other science fiction movie that you have, there's never an archeologist on board. You know, and to me it's like, you know are kidding me, that's the first person to go somewhere because of comparison of our past with whatever's going on at the destination planet, but instead they bring a whole bunch of yahoos with them, that you know, of course, you know it's only entertainment that you're seeing, but I think that the whole Prometheus thing, it's a... it's a beautiful movie I think, it's great entertainment too

JoeRogan: I didn't like it, it's really good to look at but I didn't like it. I , I thought there were too many hokey fucking moments in it, but I thought, it could have been an incredible movie but, it seemed like there's, it seemed like some, I would love to sit down with Ridley Scott and get high with him and go wow what happened man.

Noomi Rapace and Logan Marshall-Green
as archeologists Dr Elizabeth Shaw and Dr Charlie Holloway

Tsoukalis: Get him on the podcast

JoeRogan: Ridley Scott's not doing my fucking podcast

Tsoukalis: You'd be surprised

JoeRogan: He'd be the guy, I've got shit to do. Not Specially after I told him that I don't like Prometheus. Hey fucking punk assed bitch, that did fear factor factor shit not Prometheus but er, I love Alien, I love Gladiator, I think he's amazing, does amazing movies, but that movie, just was, it was okay, I would even see it again if it was on TV or something, I might even buy the DVD, just to watch it for a little while, but it could have been so much more. But it was er, the idea behind it, that , you know, we were engineered and created, it's so, they handled that pretty well, I thought they handled the, it was fascinating, you know, the concept behind it, though the black stuff that becomes the alien is a little bit kind of a pain in the ass

Tsoukalis: Yuh

JoeRogan: It's hard to wrap your head around, it's like they have a chart of the morphology, like how people become that thing, how that thing is created, how the alien from the first movie Alien, they've actually charted it out, like where it comes from, like this is, like when a man gets infected then gives it to a woman and creates this fucking octopus looking thing

Tsoukalis: oaaaah, okay

JoeRogan: like when the woman for pregnant,

Tsoukalis:yeah

JoeRogan: that's why, because it was a man who got infected and then he. impregnated her and then the infection takes that form so the, it produces one type of offspring, or if one of the engineers gets infected, the it produces another type of thing, you know,  it's like they've all plotted it out like at the end spoiler! spoiler! shouldn't be saying this spoilers, I shouldn't tell people, what happened, it's not a bad movie, but it's just not as good as Alien, Alien 1 is the shits, still to this day one of the greatest movies of all time

Tsoukalis: Aliens was good too

Joe Rogan: Yeah

Tsoukalis:Aliens was good, different, different but good

Joe Rogan: oh totally. very fun, but the aliens were too easy to kill, that's what pissed me off, like all of a sudden, you could kill them like that because the first one, that one Alien was super sneaky and fucked everybody up, now they're like real obvious in your face, running at you, like, come on man, like they were like masters, like the first alien was always creeping up on bitches and then jacking them, and the second ones like heghhhhhh and its running at you and you have to shotgun it. It was still a fun movie but was in my opinion, they changed the characteristics of the thing. If Aliens was, all these things were super clever and all these things were really stealthy and they moved at, that would have been an even more terrifying movie, it was really hard to kill them, but they're just out there running and you shoot 'em. It seems they've changed the whole fucking movie, you know what I'm saying

James Spader as archeologist Dr Daniel Jackson in Stargate (1994)

Tsoukalis: The advent of video games

Joe Rogan:If that's what it is, that's what it is, it became like er, Alien vs Predator. How did that happen.

Tsoukalis: Terrible. Terrible!

Joe Rogan: It's ridiculous, combining too fucking silly movies and one of them takes place in the future you fuck

Joe Rogan: Hahah

Joe Rogan: One of them takes place now, one of them takes place a fucking thousand years from now, they're all... What! Come on. Right out of here

Joe Rogan: No, I love it

Joe Rogan: In Alien Vs Predator, didn't it have some sort of an Ancient Aliens premise to it

Tsoukalis: It did, it did that er, the Predators were worshipped by the Maya

Joe Rogan: Yeah

Tsoukalis: And there was this fight going on between the Predators and the Maya, or the Aliens ever since Mayan times and the Mayans were in between, that's how they disappeared because they all got eaten up and things like that, so I mean, interesting, but a trip

Joe Rogan: Yeah, what is the best version er, what you think in the science fiction of what, in alien life is going to be, do you think it's Prometheus

Tsoukalis: Most recently yes, but then you have to ask yourself, you know, who created the engineers?

Joe Rogan: Right

Tsoukalis: Who engineered the engineers and this is why in my opinion, you can never really lose your belief in all encompassing force in the universe which I refer to as God, or actually, you know, the vice versa. You know, but other science fiction movies, that portray wonderfully was the first Total Recall or Star Gate er, the original theatrical release, Mission To Mars, all those movies were wonderful Ancient Alien type movies that described the ancient alien theory very nicely, not necessarily to the, you know, in Star Gate's accurately because in my opinion, I don't think we were ever a slave species for example as so many other ancient alien theorists subscribe to

Joe Rogan: That's Sitchin as well right

Tsoukalis: Yeah, yeah, and that always, and he knows as I've told him this when he was still alive that I actually disagreed with him, you know what

Joe Rogan: Damned, you disagreed with Sitchin

Tsoukalis: Of course,

Joe Rogan: Woah

Tsoukalis: But the thing is, it doesn't matter

Joe Rogan: Very cocky

Tsoukalis: It doesn't matter because in the end, the theory itself that we were visited remains the same

Joe Rogan: right

Tsoukalis: Whether we are slave species or not, and I chose to think that we're not, it's irrelevant

Joe Rogan: why do you believe that? Why do you make that distinction?

Tsoukalos: Because, he proposed that we were created as worker bees to mine gold for the Annunaki who needed gold for their atmosphere on their home planet. Michiu Kaku has proposed or calculated that er, there is the same amount of gold on any body found in the universe so to suggest that they had to come specifically here to find gold logically speaking doesn't make much sense

Joe Rogan:So he's saying that gold exists on Saturn, gold exists on Neptune

Tsoukalos: Every single planetary body in all the galaxy

Joe Rogan:The same amount of gold

Tsoukalos: Yes, because it all expanded from the big bang, it all was distributed evenly

Joe Rogan:What about gas planets, gas giants

Tsoukalos: I, you know, you would have to ask Kakhu for this but the whole idea that solid objects contained the same amount of gold, he proposed that aliens wouldn't have to come here, if they wanted to mine gold.

Joe Rogan:Well maybe,

Tsoukalos: Well that

Joe Rogan: maybe it's both, maybe they came here to engineer people but they also need gold, so they engineer people to make gold, but it's both, it's not just, it's like a dual project

Tsoukalos: Sure

Joe Rogan: It's not just an evolutionary project

Tsoukalos: yeah, that's an interesting er, er you know approach to looking at it, however, you know, the whole slave species thing, it feeds into this current belief that we are beholden to someone else, that we are not in control of our lives, that we and our governments are ruled by aliens and there's reptilians and all that bullshit that er, you know, people really think that they are no longer in charge of their own lives, that everything is, you know, er , planned and overlooked by our alien overlords and that to me, you know, even to a guy like me, that is too fucking far out and come one, just go back, come back to reality, put your feet on the ground and try to differentiate between what's actually feasible and something that you know if science fiction.

Part 2 of Prometheus chat after chat about human's treatment of dolphins and apes

Joe Rogan: I would love it if it were true where it got to a point where these super intelligent so far advanced from us would look at us and go, ah you guys, you guys are pretty cool, we're not going to fuck with you, you know when we come , we're not going to make you

Tsoukalos: We're going to let you figure it out

Joe Rogan: And we're not going to er, we're not going to exploit you the way you do and every other form of life does on this planet. I think that was one thing that Prometheus got that I thought was pretty probably dead on that was the disdain that the engineers would have for humans

Tsoukalos: After what happened, how we...how we turned out

Joe Rogan: The same way we would if we went to the fucking jungle and there was a tribe of chimps that had created electricity and they were shooting lightning bolts at each other and 'we would'/'people' (?), like "bitch, what the fuck are you doing", we would completely take it away from them, and if we were going to change them and fix them, we would have no problem with that

Tsoukalos:  well hence, that's why we have stories of UFOs disabling nuclear plants

Joe Rogan: Hence that's why we have planet of the apes, we would take a chimp and make it super intelligent and it gets fucking really pissed at us, but we'd do it

The Hammerpede

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Prometheus creature designs

Introducing the Hammerpede

Carlos Huante's facehugger centipede

victim's phallic cranial transformation concept

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Carlos Huante

In the centipede attack, the victim's cranium begins to phallicly stretches out at the back complete with testicular bulges. One might start to ask what is happening here, is there a transformation taking place where the human becomes an alien creature with a cranium similar to the one shown down at the bottom of this page with a male member with testicles sticking out of the back of the cranium. The translucent dome of the alien creature appears to look inflated like a balloon

concept for an Ultramorph

Carlos Huante's Facehugger Centipede attack

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Carlos Huante
and 
The hammerpede

a) Carlos Huante wanted to introduce the concept of a face hugger centipede as if this was the first thing that the Engineers had created, the precursor to the face hugger, a centipede version of this creature with a perhaps a hundred fingers, this thing crawls around and then in the movie grabs the victim by the arm leading to the impregnation in the film

b) And so it was imagined that elements from the face hugger centipede experiment resulted in the Facehugger. But in the final movie, Ridley would transform the idea into an attack by worms transformed by the black goo into creatures known as Hammerpedes

c) Carlos explored the idea that this human's impregnation by the alien centipede leads to an entity referred to as Belugahead and Babyhead shown in his early storyboard and another version of the transformation displays a humanoid with a male member with testicles growing out of the back of the head that seemed to show up in the head of a Carlos' version of an alien humanoid.

Carlos Huante's Babyhead storyboards

source quotes:

1. Carlos Huante: I go" Oh, we have to have the, the precursor to the facehugger, that looks like this centipede thing that is -- centipede of the facehugger who's got like a hundred fingers.  (40:00) This thing just crawls around and that's the thing that attacks the guy, grabs him, it grabs his arm, then we could have that cool 1970s science-fiction astronaut you know, looking at his arm. This thing has grabbed his hand, and you know, that'd be cool, right? And I know Ridley's all about that. He gets that.(Furious Gods documentary)
2. Carlos Huante: Facehugger centipede - to show that this design worked but was an experiment and elements were used for the 'Facehugger'. (Carlos Huante's Alien Notebook)

Hammerpede from Carlos Huante's Alien Notebook

Rubber Johnny

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Chris Cunningham

and 

Fifield monster

 A possible starting point behind the Prometheus film's final Fifield Monster is the cocaine snorting hydrocephalic wheelchair bound character Rubber Johnny in the video by Chris Cunningham released in 2005 for a music track by that name by Aphex Twin. It was made as a Warp film in association with Black Dog Films/Ridley Scott Associates.

snapshot from Rubber Johnny

snapshot from Rubber Johnny

Behind the scenes shot of Chris Cunningham in
prosthetic makeup for Rubber Johnny

sketch of Fifield with expanded head by Carlos Huante

belugahead experiment by Carlos Huante

The Trilobyte

leading from
Prometheus Creature Designs

1. chihuly-chihulien-chihulybite

Changes to the Space Jockey's telescope viewerin Prometheus

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Space jockeys renamed engineers

1) The Original Space Jockey's telescope view from Alien.

The face of the telescope viewing device of the space jockey chair in Alien was not seen. The photographs shown of it were not entirely clear, showing at least one clear circular viewing device, but in Giger's Alien Diary published in 2013, photos clearly showed two medium sized circular shapes running up the centre with two smaller circles either side and at least one smaller circle above.

Original Space Jockey's telescope view from Giger's Alien Diary

closeup of original Space Jockey's telescope view from Giger's Alien Diary

2 Ben Procter's telescope viewing device

Ben Procter was required to recreate the original Space Jockey chair with various changes made to it. The panel shown above has suddenly been changed into a design that was a lot more organic with four circles either side and the impressions of ribbed piping. Perhaps the basic central details added to the centre of the thing can not be described so easily

Space Jockey's telescope viewer as designed by Ben Procter

3) The final space jockey viewing device

Glowing semi spheres have been added to the viewing device, and he touches it as if activating controls. However this humanoid in the seat is much smaller than the space jockey from the original movie to the point of being generally the size of a very tall Earth human.

Ganesh with a breathing pipe trunk

leading from 

Prometheus afterthoughts

a) In the TV series Ancient Aliens presented by Giorgiou Tsoukalis, a man who is one of the many fans of Alien, Aliens, and indeed Prometheus and indeed HR Giger. A question asked is if the Hindu god Ganesh was an extra-terrestrial visitor wearing breathing apparatus that might have been mistaken for an elephant's head and trunk. The space jockey was sometimes described as having a head like an elephant. The comic books made this even more so by having the breathing pipe attached to it's nose area look like an elephant trunk. The skull was roughly elephantine perhaps.

b) Giger created strange humanoid heads with breathing pipes extending from the nasal cavity. (See Space Jockey's Evolution via Gigers Necronomicon part 2) The Engineer's suits in Prometheus supposed to be the same as the space jockeys from Alien were humans with helmets roughly like the head of the space jockey but were made more like an elephantine due to different aesthetic choices.

Engineer with helmet in Prometheus

c) However it seems that in a preview for Ancient Aliens, a stature was shown showing a Ganesh with segmented breathing pipe in place of a trunk, ending in a bowl in such  way that it resembled a breathing filter. The thing is presented as a genuine ancient relic, whether it is or it isn't.

Ganesh sculpture

detail from above

The question of the Space Jockey as a suit

Leading from

Prometheus afterthoughts

 (i) The "Space Jockey as a suit"
(ii) Just like "Fire in the Sky"
(iii) Independence Day biomechanical suits

Likely inspiration for the Engineer's hibernation mask

The mask for the engineer while in hibernation with pipes sprouting from the mask like tendrils or spiders legs even. Curiously it resembles the top part of Giger's painting "Behemoth" which is to be found in Giger's Necronomicon. Presumably Ridley Scott used Giger's painting to show what he wanted before the concept design team explored the idea further translating the idea.

1. The writer here suddenly made the connection on the morning of October 25th, 2012

bust of engineer with hibernation mask

H R Giger's 'Behemoth" (Source Giger's Necronomicon)

Gutalin's concept artwork

detail from H R Giger's 'Behemoth" (source: Giger's Necronomicon)

detail of bust of engineer with hibernation mask